Spray Guns - Sata or harbor freight

[Robert Freemond]

I’m sure that this subject has been discussed many times here, but I’ve missed them.
I am currently in the middle of (over my head) painting my car, & have been reading a
bunch about Spray Guns. Like any other tool, 500 users 600 theories. I’m sure that
most of the builders here do their own finishing & consequently use a variety spray
guns from Sata to Harbor freight so, I would like to hear their opinions on the
subject, or links to previous discussions would be good too.

My experience started with a Binks then a Binks copy touch up, a small HVLP & finally
a full sized HVLP 1.3. All have worked OK, or so I thought...Until I tried something really big.

What do Guitar makers really need ?

[Todd Stock]

I am a fan of turbine guns here in muggy, super humid MD...dry air really helps reduce the blush, and the cost of a very good turbine setup runs less than a decent compressor. With the introduction of gravity feed/pressure cup guns with fan width control a few years back, there's been no reason to drag my Sata or Iwata conversion guns out. Summary: gun as good as the $600-$700 Sata and Iwata guns, and better for cool/humid conditions than conversion guns. Mini-Mite 4 four stage with T-75G gun...about $760...MiniMite 3 three stage about $620 (if all you will be spraying is clear finishes...).

If you already have a decent sized (60 gallon or larger) compressor, filters and traps, at least in-line dryers, and money is a big issue, the Sharpe Fx-2000 is pretty decent for a budget gun, or look at the Iwata Ls400 with a 1.3 tip if cost is not as big an issue. Sometimes you can find decent guns at bargain prices on craigslist, and for the cost of a rebuild kit, can be on your way (which is how I got my Sata 3). Some of the automotive folks swear by the HF guns after cleaning - I use one of their jamb guns for shooting metallics - but get the right part number...they change manufacturers and specs frequently. Nice thing is that if the gun is packed with crud and even after cleaning, still sucks, take it back and exchange...you might go thru a few guns before finding one that works, but if your time is more available than dollars, it can work for you.

[Aaron Helt]

I use Sharpe Finesse guns. They are very reasonably priced <$125, and spray fine. One head's up that I have found is that really cheap guns are not machined well internally and tend to be nearly impossible to thoroughly clean. Gunk is held internally and really makes spraying difficult with nozzle clogs and just poor pattern. I threw them out after using them for auto body primer work. And they weren't much good at primer.

[Clay Schaeffer]

"What do Guitar makers really need ?"

How many guitars are you finishing, with what finish, and how long do you want to spend sanding and buffing?

[Todd Stock]

"What do Guitar makers really need ?"

My bad...the correct answer is "A gainfully employed spouse with generous family heath and dental plan, and possessing near infinite patience and a willingness to ignore the slow takeover of all open space in the dwelling with luthiery-related activities."

[Clay Schaeffer]

Clay Schaeffer wrote:
"What do Guitar makers really need ?"


My bad...the correct answer is "A gainfully employed spouse with generous family heath and dental plan, and possessing near infinite patience and a willingness to ignore the slow takeover of all open space in the dwelling with luthiery-related activities."


I was quoting the original poster - but your answer is true enough!

As to spray guns, for limited use and a willingness to refine the end product by sanding and buffing, a cheap gun will work fine. Following this line of thought to it's most elemental level, even a paint brush will work fine.

[Robert Freemond]

Hi Everyone, Today I shot 4 coats of Clear Coat on the hood & I'm up to my ears in Orange Peel. I was hoping I could get away without color sanding, but no soap.
The temperature was about 85° I'm obviously no expert but it seemed as though; because of the heat, the CC should have been thinner or I should have been using a larger tip.
or perhaps my compressors is not adequate. (4HP 20 Gal.) Is that small ?

Clay, I've been shooting Water based Lacquer KTM-9 on about 15 Guitars in 7 years, but may have never been doing it correctly.
I suppose I could use a Broom, but I don't enjoy sanding that much ;-)
I guess the question is: How do i confirm that my setup is OK.

Todd, Dreaming big is good...

[Bob Gramann]

Orange peel with my equipment usually means that the spray is not sufficiently atomized. I increase the regulated air pressure to the gun. I have an Asturo ECO/SX HVLP gravity feed gun. The sweet spot seems to be about 40-42 psi from the regulator. I'm using a 1.3 tip and spraying Target EM6000 water-based lacquer.

[Todd Stock]

Real issue on compressor is size of tank and output at line pressure...a 20 gallon 4 hp compressor (what I use for construction work) will run a Sata Minigun or similar high efficiency gun on the duty cycle you'll need to spray guitars, but not a full sized gun shooting automotive stuff. Orange peel is usually either the spray drying before contact (spraying too far away) or (more than likely), failure to properly atomize the finish. Spray at the recommended distance and fan width for the gun and work, up the pressure (which will decrease transfer efficiency and increase 'bounce' and thin as necessary to get the viscosity in the range needed. Coats should be wet (usually about 5 wet mils for lacquer thinned 85/15 and less for WB stuff), so if you cannot get a wet coat built with a slow-to-moderate speed pass, try opening up the material flow and up the airflow or tip pressure if atomization is not enough, as well as reduce the fan width a bit if spraying a wide fan (I like 6" for guitars...with the T-75G, you can go from almost airbrush-like touchup pattern to 10" fan, so play with your gun on samples to figure out the combination of tip pressure, fan width, and material knob that will get you a wet coat on a consistent basis.

[Robert Freemond]

Todd...Thanks, This is all good Info. I'm sure that my problem was as you said (failure to properly atomize the finish) I held a 6" fan width at about 6" distance & traveled as slow as I dared.
I have more to do on the car so i'm sure that things will improve & this should really help my Guitar finishing.

[Dan Smith]

I've sprayed nitro on several solid bodies using the $15 Harbor Freight gun.
It worked, but I had plenty of overspray and orange peel.
Lots of level sanding was required. I used almost a quart of lacquer on each guitar.
I want to invest in a moderately priced gun (around $100) but of course I have no idea how to choose one.
I'm reading reviews and doing research.

[Michael Lewis]

It turns out that YOU are the most important element in the spraying process. YOU must understand the process and how to deal with issues as they arise. You can do a great job with a cheap gun if you know what you are doing, and conversely an expensive gun will not make you a great finisher. Don't get me wrong, good tools are definitely a benefit and cheap tools are less helpful, but most of it is up to you.

[Clay Schaeffer]

Hi Robert,
For painting a car your compressor is a bit undersized. I'm not saying it can't work, but being able to push more finish through a larger gun to lay down a wet coat over the entire surface before it starts to set up is a definite plus. If you want to paint the car piece meal then buffing to get a more uniform finish might be your best option.
I don't have much experience with water based finishes, but many body shops use them and are happy with the results. They also have better setups than the average do it your selfer.
What kind of car are you painting?

[Robert Freemond]

That's my plan Clay, - One section at a time - I'm using Omni paint by PPG it's not their top o the line, but it's OK for what I'm doing. I'm restoring a 1990 Isuzu Trooper 11.
i looked into water based but it was almost twice the price. There are so many new guns on the market now & some say they work OK on small compressors - I'm still looking.

[Clay Schaeffer]

Hi Robert,
If you are not going to be painting cars on a regular basis, you might consider doing all the prep work (body work, priming, and taping off) and having a paint shop shoot the color and clear coats. The prep work is where most of the labor is, and some shops will agree to this arrangement.
It does sound like you are fairly into the project though, so "staying the course" may be your best option. Omni paint gets mixed reviews (I have never used it) and spraying panel by panel is not the best method, but with sanding and buffing you might get a decent job.

[Todd Stock]

1990 Trooper was the next-to-last year with the box body, right? Very much a utility vehicle (wife owned a 1991 Troop II with the Aussie welded aluminum front & rear bumper/bull bar/bush guards...perfect for the DC beltway...sold with 227K 14 years ago and still on road). Maybe shoot some satin urban camo and screw the gloss? FWIW, drove Trooper II's all over Central & South America (blends in better than a Hummer)...never stuck, never stranded, and pulled many a Land Rover, Mitsubishi, Toy, and Jeep out of trouble. Good luck with the restoration.

[Robert Freemond]

Thanks Dude... Camo ain't my style but I hear where you're coming from. I did a bit of color sanding & buffing yesterday so I know now what I'm in for. The CC sands harder than water based lac. yet it's not as brittle. ( I scraped some from a mixing cup) Now I'm looking into color sanding with a DA sander.

[Steven Odut]

I've never had a harbour freight gun (or any other gun), but I am very happy with my Sata MiniJet IV. It works great for guitars and small furniture projects spraying shellac, nitrocellulose lacquer, and water based lacquer. It was not cheap, but I'm happy with it.

The MiniJet would be small for a large project like a car (spray pattern is only about 6-8" wide).

But the gun doesn't spray by itself...spraying is a skill in itself that I have to relearn every 6 months or so when I finish a project.

[Randolph Rhett]

I hate spraying so much I've returned to French Polish for all my guitars. Of course, you can't French Polish a car!!!