MIMF

So I have had a family member express an interest in having a Welsh harp built for her...

I've built a few guitars, tenor guitars and Ukes but never a harp and certainly not a Welsh Harp.. In fact other than the very basics I don't even really know what Welsh Harp is.. I know it has 3 courses or rows of strings with the middle row being akin to the black keys on a piano but things like spacing and just general design are a bit of a mystery and plans seem non-existant..

Anybody have any info or sources or maybe even plans or have built on in the past?????

I live in Canada so the chances of finding one here to look at are a bit slim I think but I will be going to Wales next year (not for harp research) so I would even like ideas where to look for information there, particularly in the north where I will be visiting.

Thanks

Kerry

http://www.welsh-harps.com/
Just found this. . . .I had to look and see what a Welsh Harp was

There are actually a few harpmakers who publish books / plans online. Some aimed more toward amateurs.

As far as i understand the process it is wise to start from planning the tonal range, the strings and the string load and to design the instrument around that data.

Here a few resources:

http://www.harpkit.com/product/fhjcd01.html
http://www.masterkit.com/musical/harp.htm

From your description, it sounds like you are looking for information on the triple harp. Here is a wikipedia article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triple_harp

It appears that the founder of the company Bob links to, is the son of the man who revived building triple harps in Wales. However I could find no triple harps on that site.

Are You REALLY sure You mean a triple harp? That's something for experienced harp players. Or people as crazy as me.
What kind of music does Your family member (want to) play? The most common harp constructions use just one single chorus.

But if You do understand the material in the resources given You should be able to transfer that to the more complicated constructions; it is quite straightforward when You ave pictures of some instruments at hand.
A while ago i was in the planning phase for a chromatic harp (and therefore actually bought the online book i linked to) - i did not start the project due to lack of space for the instrument...

A big issue with most harp constructions is, btw, the torsional force on the bow. Quit obviously on a chromatic instrument or a double chorus harp that is much less an issue - but literature wise these instruments are niche instruments.

BTW: as an obviously first time builder You might have a look at the sweetharp concept. The following link of a user shows enough detail, and the construction seems to be simple enough for me as an amateur first time builder to repeat: http://karstilo.net/musik/harfe/sweetharp.html

If it's a triple harp you want, that's a big task and a lot of research.
Here's a nice one:
http://www.metmuseum.org/collection/the ... rch/501665
Many people in Wales play lever harp though.

Folks, thanks for the replies

YES it is a Triple Harp I am talking about, My family member has a degree in music is a teacher and a player of multiple instruments (no harps), is she crazy... perhaps.. she has a Welsh heritage so comes by the desire honestly I guess.

As for me I'm not an expert luthier by any ones definition but I have built about 15 string instruments in the past few years ranging from dulcimers to MandoCellos... I don't "think" there is anything too difficult about most of the harps I've seen or at least nothing I am not willing to attempt.. foolish yes perhaps but it is all good fun and a challenge...

Beate, I may have to ask you a few questions since you are the only person I have found who will admit to owning a Triple Harp

The link to the Sweetharp is interesting, I have thought for sometime about building a simple Celtic harp, I have a slightly more sane friend who is interested in that.... The Triple Harp is a new request and I have only said I would look into it

After I've done a bit more research I'll see what is possible and have a chat with my family member...

THanks again for the info

Kerry

The sweetharp looks pretty close to a Paraguayan harp. For beginners, you can't go to far wrong looking up John Kovac, harpmaker on the internet. He sells a book with full-size plans for each of three harps - 3, 4, and 5 octaves. I built two of the 4-octave harps from solid wood (sides and ends of body, pillar) and baltic birch plywood (neck, soundboard, and back) and they sound really good, considering. I really like the double-neck concept and don't see why it can't be adapted for other string arrangemennts than the simple diatonic Paraguayan harp. My youngest daughter has been clamoring for one with sharping levers - I'm thinking about it.

You can ask me questions, but i am not sure if i can really answer.

Kerry Werry wrote:F
Beate, I may have to ask you a few questions since you are the only person I have found who will admit to owning a Triple Harp

No, i do not own any harp nor can i play it. About two years ago i had the idea of building one, bought some literature (yes, John Kovac's book) and tried to understand a bit more on the construction because i wanted to build a chromatic harp. Not a triple harp - that's something very different. Chromatic harps usually have two crossed rows of strings, therefore a much larger string tension which acts on the top, on the other side a symmetrical load on the bow and therefore reduced tendency to warping. I stopped at the point where i needed more information on the construction of the top.

I dropped the idea because of lack of space in my appartment and a lot of engagement as a bass player. Maybe i'll have the opportunity to pick it up again, and may also be i should start with an electric. Not before the archtop bass is done...

Thanks again for the info, I see John Kovac has some simple plans for a Paraguayan harp, I may well try and build one just to see how it goes..

However I also do like a challenge as far as building goes so the Welsh Triple Harp sounds like it does fit that We will see if my relative is up for the challenge of playing and if she is I guess I will be building or trying to build one at some point...

Kerry

As far as i recall from memory: the Paraguay harps are played with steel strings and lower tension than the celtic harps. Although the sweetharp uses guitar tuners like a Paraguay harp, it appears to be a typical celtic harp string- and tensionwise, and the shape of the bow is clearly inspired by gothic harps. That's what i referred to when i wrote that harp construction starts from a string- and tension layout. Everything else follows from this, especially the construction of the top. And that's the point where the harp making literature turns out to be a lot less specific as the guitar or violin making literature.

I always wondered if techniques used on guitar tops (i.e. thin tops with bracing) were also applicable to harp making...

I always assumed the Paraguayan harps were gut strung.
An old pedal harp I have (in pieces) used a relatively thin soundboard that tapered in thickness from top to bottom, with two braces that ran the length of the soundboard as well as the string reinforcement strip in the center.

In my opinion, the huge advantage of the Paraguayan harp, which the Sweetharp seems to share, is the double neck, which allows a much lighter structure because the neck is pulled straight down, rather than being pulled off to one side as in traditional Celtic harp designs. In the Kovacs model of Paraguayan harps, the neck is not even glued to the body and the pillar, it is held in place entirely by string tension.

The harps I built using John Kovacs' plans and hardware/string kits are nylon strung.

As far as making harps with thin, braced soundboards, it is interesting. The strings are pulling at a much greater angle than for a guitar or lute type instrument, so it seems the bracing would have to be different.

Am I mistaken, or does the grain on a solid wood harp top run crosswise instead of length wise? Thinking about the stresses involved, my first inclination would be to use ladder braces rather than lengthwise braces.

I think the central neck issue is a red herring, no more of a problem than guitar or violin.

Yes modern harps usually have cross grain thin spruce soundboard, some are unbraced and many have longitudinal braces. All have a longitudinal strip on bo sides where the strings attach to the soundboard.

Older styles (including the 18th century triple harps like the link I put) have longitudinal grain. Very different sound and construction philosophy.

I'm not an expert, but I am a thinker. Violin strings are low tension, and usually don't cause structural damage. Guitar strings (steel ones especially) do cause structural damage even in a well made guitar- they pull the bridge up and back, and bend the neck. Neck resets needed every 20 years or so, are an indication of the flaws (or tradeoffs, if you will) of guitar design. I've no experience but I've read about the sideways stress on conventional Celtic harp necks. These are avoided in the double neck design.

Beate Ritzert wrote:There are actually a few harpmakers who publish books / plans online. Some aimed more toward amateurs.

There's also a Yahoo group for harpmakers. I have found it to an unsurpassed source for information on techniques, plans, and sources. And everybody is welcome there, from first-time harp builders to experienced luthiers (many of whom are on that forum).

Any questions you have about harp building will be answered with far more authority than can be expected from this forum, since they will be answered by men and women with years of harp-building experience under their belts.

As far as i understand the process it is wise to start from planning the tonal range, the strings and the string load and to design the instrument around that data.

You are quite right. And this is why a novice builder would be well advised to build from plans that have proved their merit, rather than trying to adapt a set of plans that was designed for a different stringband and tension.