converting Martin archtop to flat top .

[Dave Anderson]

I have a customer who is considering this.
Has anyone here done this job?

[Jason Rodgers]

Did you go to Joe Konkoly's lecture at GAL 2011 about vintage restoration? That lecture is written up in AL#111 and addresses exactly what you're talking about (though not in a lot of detail, iirc). http://www.luth.org/back_issue/al109-112/al111.html

[Michael Lewis]

I would recommend against doing the "conversion" for a couple reasons: there weren't many Martin artchtops to begin with so they are becoming more rare, and why not just get a recent D-28 and have done with the search for a good guitar? Martin is making guitars better now than they ever did, but they are not old, . . . . . yet.

A converted Martin is not a real collectors item, it is a modified guitar. It will cost money to have it modified, and devalue it at the same time, both as an archtop and as a Martin D-28 wannabe. Once the work is done that bell cannot be un-rung.

That's my opinion and I'm sticking with it. As a repairman and as a service center for the Martin Guitar Co. I have seen some things over the years that probably started out as what seemed like a good idea at the time but were regretful later on. A couple D-28s at different times that had style 45 trim installed come to mind. One was of pre-war vintage, the other was from the 50s, and both lost value in the process even though it cost a lot to have the work done. (I did not do the work). Also one archtop that had been converted to a flat top, and you could tell it was not a factory job. Another loss of value. Also a D-18 from 1936 that had a 12 string neck attached, another lost treasure. Just leave them in original condition and play them.

I will admit that Martin didn't really understand archtops too well, but those guitars played well and made music.

[Michael Lewis]

Dave, have you ever re-topped a guitar? It's a lot of work, probably worth at least a couple K for a nice job, but this guitar would take a bit more than that because of the neck angle. Having been made as an archtop the neck angle is very high for a flat top, but you probably know that. The neck would need a reset where the material removed from the neck would be at the top of the heel, which will move the 14th fret over the body and consequently the bridge would have to be set that far back too, thus straying a bit from the dreadnaught design. Or you would have to add wedges from the bottom of the heel, and this would show. Just a thought.

[Dave Anderson]

Did you go to Joe Konkoly's lecture at GAL 2011 about vintage restoration? That lecture is written up in AL#111 and addresses exactly what you're talking about (though not in a lot of detail, iirc). http://www.luth.org/back_issue/al109-112/al111.html

Yes,I was at his lecture and I have read the article in Am. Luth.Thanks.

[Dave Anderson]

Michael, You make very good points about not doing the conversion and I do agree with you. I have done a lot of work for this customer over many years and many vintage guitars.If I can't talk him out of it and If he insists the job be done would you still refuse and have him go to another repairman? I'm kind of torn between doing it, if he insists or turning him down. I've never done a conversion like this but I know I can do it . I have told him about the neck problems and what a time consuming and expensive job it will be. Thanks for your comments and advice.

[Bob Gramann]

It seems that it would be so much easier to make him a flat top guitar based on the Martin archtop. Then, he would have both guitars and the performance of the flat top would probably exceed what he would have gotten from the conversion.

[Michael Lewis]

Dave, what specific model is the guitar? I will hazard a guess it is from the 30s.

[Paco Jimenez]

The bigger ones, the C series, had a special body shape that later became the OM size for the flat-tops. Yes, that size was developed for archtops first. The R series... I cannot remember it now for sure. I think they were 00 bodies. AFAIK... Oh and the scarcer top end F series were a special size used only for these archtops.

[Dave Anderson]

Dave, what specific model is the guitar? I will hazard a guess it is from the 30s.

Yes, It's a 1934 C-2

[Michael Lewis]

It is much easier to keep the guitar intact as original, and as said previously, they are becoming more rare as many of the few that were made have been converted.

IF you are going to do the conversion first take a look at Joe Konkoly's web site. It would be best to closely follow the Martin design for all the parts, and for that I think some deep homework is called for. It deserves to be an over the top quality job or should not be done. Just sayin'

[Dave Anderson]

It is much easier to keep the guitar intact as original, and as said previously, they are becoming more rare as many of the few that were made have been converted.

IF you are going to do the conversion first take a look at Joe Konkoly's web site. It would be best to closely follow the Martin design for all the parts, and for that I think some deep homework is called for. It deserves to be an over the top quality job or should not be done. Just sayin'

I talked to the guy today and I think he is backing off the idea to convert it and that's fine but If I end up doing this job,it will definitely be done as close to Martins design as possible.Thanks Michael.

[Art Davila]

I am new to guitar building but have been a custom furniture builder as a side profession for 15 years.

I had a customer who wanted me to take a valuable antique (which he had purchased expressly for this project) and cut it down to make a bathroom vanity.

I told him I can do the job, or instead I could also build a replica from scratch that would cost less and be built from the ground up to be a bathroom vanity. Then if he wanted to sell the antique, he could pay me for the new vainty and put money back in his pocket.

Guess which way he decided to go.

That's right he still wanted me to cut up the antique.
He said he didn't care about the money, he wanted to use the antique.

I charged him double and we both were happy.