Leaving a smidgeon of fingerboard to meet string span

[Philip Donovan]

Hello,

As I approach the point of getting ready to glue a pre-slotted/pre-radiused (16") ebony fingerboard to a maple neck base (28.625 scale with hotrod trussrod), I have it in the plans to allow a very small sliver of fingerboard to extend beyond the edges of the neck base in order to meet up with the sting width span. This is actually an electric 28.625" scale baritone build that will be used exclusively for the type of fingerstyle you would expect on an acoustic guitar (McManus, Wake, Hedges, etc...). The luthier that examined my guitar body, fingerboard and neck base told me he "thinks" the dimensions as is could allow a reasonable distance of E strings to fingerboard edge but, seeing that this guitar will be seeing alot of pull offs along with a capo on most of the time, he said that ever-so-slightly extending the ebony fingerboard beyond the edges of the neck base is a feasible approach as long as it is not excessive. He described "excessive" as anything approaching 1/16 of an inch, which I would not be coming anywhere near. If I need any extending at all, it likely wouldn't be any more than say, 1/32nd of an inch on each side, any perhaps not even that.

I probably wouldn't make a final call until the neck was fitted to the body and I strung some strings in place with the bridge in order to see where the outer strings fell in relation to the edge of the fingerboard in conjunction with the bridge spacing. Of course I have pondered just getting a narrower bridge but, with this guitar being for complex fingerstyle, only, I really desired to keep a wide right hand string spread to compliment the nuanced targeting of strings - More space allows a greater isolated targeting of strings with regards to the right hand.

This way, I won't get stuck with strings too close to the edge and constantly falling off the edge of the fingerboard. that would be a real drag. I figure if I left a smidgeon of meat on either side, I could prudently adjust the fingerboard width to the best width for the application. And if I realize I never even needed any extention, then fine. All I've lost is some time and calories.

I wanted to run this by some of you experienced builders out there for feedback, as this is my first neck, and want to do everything I can to see if I can "get it right the first time". Unfortunately, pretty much any project I've done has actually worked - but, I am stupidly obsessive in reasearching information and being ridiculously careful - measure 100 times, go to bed, ruminate for days, measure 100 more times and repeat". That bad.

Thanks everyone, I'm really excited about this project. The body came out beyond what I expected, and I'm hoping for something like that on my first neck build.

Thank you very much for your time!
Best
Phil Donovan

[Barry Daniels]

I would never make a neck like that. The fingerboard should be flush with the neck. If you want a wider fretboard then make a wider neck to match.

[JC Whitney]

Assuming the neck is unfinished and not yet assembled, how about adding an 1/8" of matching maple stock to each side and then planing back to your desired width?

[Peter Wilcox]

If the neck is already cut to width, I'd think you could make the bottom of the fret board the width of the neck, and bevel out to the top the 1/32 inch, which shouldn't be very noticeable, assuming the fret board to be 1/4 inch thick (arctan 0.125 = 7 degrees.)

[Philip Donovan]

Thanks everyone for your feedback here. Optimally, yes I would just make another neck but, for very silly reasons, I can't do that right now. (Long boring story).
I was thinking along the lines that Peter is alluding to. The neck base is already shaped to final dimension. The fingerboard though is still at stew macs full new width. At the slight increase/extension that I was imagining, it seemed like a slight bevel to the neck base could be feasible. Also, since this is a dedicated fingerstyle instrument application, I would be tending to use a more classical left hand form where fingers arc away and down to the fingerboard - as opposed to my classic rock gigs where I'm clenching the neck like climbing a rope. That works for bluesy style "strangle the cat" kind of playing but, this fingerstyle baritone will not be seeing any of that. Its going to be much more important what is happening with the top of the fingerboard - the thumb primarily at the very back of the neck 97% of the time.

To Peters approach, I will likely put alot of thought into a similar method as he's described. I do think it could work, if I'm very patient and careful. To be realistic, the luthier upon examination of the parts, thought that the final result as is would be something close to a standard Fender Tele/Strat in regards to the "string-to-edge" distance. I was just moderately concerned if that would be enough. So, the amount I would consider extending would be very very small, but maybe just enough to allow all those pull offs and sweeps that are so prevelant in especially the Celtic fingerstyle, which I plan on quite alot of.

Thank you all, you've definitely given me some things to think about and I will surely run with those ideas.
Best,
PJD3

[Bryan Bear]

I'm with Barry in that I would not want to make a neck with the fretboard anything but flush. Peter's suggestion isn't a bad one IF you can make the "Flare" of the fretboard width match the neck profile enough that it wouldn't feel strange to everyone who picks it up. If you were going that method, I would consider adding half the extra thickness to each side. That may minimize the effect, but it also may make the top side of the neck feel awful.

When concerned about fretboard width relative to the outside strings, it is important to think about the bevel on the end of the frets. I see a lot of guitars with quite a lot of bevel on the fret ends. It might feel nice but it take up a lot of real estate on the fret top. Just something to consider.

[Barry Daniels]

I agree with Bryan about the fret end bevel. If you want maximum real estate then file the frets at about 90 degrees. Just soften the edges of the fret so you don't slice a finger.

[Philip Donovan]

Thank you guys, great advice.
I've decided for the final step I will send this guitar over to Jon Mouradian in Wilmington, Ma for the fret installments and final setup. I've fairly confident I can bring it up to that point with minimal damage but, I want this to be an optimum performer, not a green experiment on my part. Perhaps my 3rd guitar I will take it to the final fretting and dressings. It was actually his idea to to a so-very-slight overhang if I was truly smitten on a wider neck. And of course, this could all be me just panicking over having not left enough outer string real estate for good "pull off execution". Well, I suppose I could convince myself that having the micro extension ends up being a misnomer on my part, then its just a matter of carefully, very carefully removing the excess overhang that was not necessary as anticipated.
The idea for a 90 deg fret end incline is a good one. I can say, the styles of performance on this guitar will call for more of a classical guitar form, meaning that there is not much dragging the meat of the hand along the neck/fingerboard edge. Thumbs at back of the neck center, and fingers arced straight down and well over the edge of the neck and strings. The type of music I will be executing on this guitar rather demands that. I have my rocking Strat and Marshall for the "blues/rock twisted rope climbing Hendrix claw drag".
I did out a drawing and some trig. the math tells me I would need a 7 degree bevel to bring a 1/32" overhang sloping into the neck base. Well, I am surrounded here in work with a number of mechanical engineers that would probably be there to help arrange a good reliable procedure for accomplishing this. I have good resources at hand for the things I come up short on which I am grateful for,
and this forum is certainly one of them!
Thank you all for your generous feedback as I precariously make my way through this project.
Best,
Phil

[Philip Donovan]

I've decided to run on my luthiers assessment that what he sees in this up and coming baritone guitar is a string-to-edge distance that is nearly typical of a standard Fender. I just don't think I have the reliable means to slightly bevel a 1/4" of fingerboard over to the maple neck base.

I have no issue with having the fret ends less beveled and more perpendicular to the neck so as to perhaps increase the distance of the string to edge. After a good deal of thought, I shouldn't go for exotic modification to a neck when I haven't even built a traditionally made neck. Thats a bit extreme at this point, well, at least for me.

Hopefully, the "not enough string/edge space" scare will turn out to be a boogie man and all will be well. And if it turns out there isn't enough space after-all, I'll look for a bridge that "is" the proper string space for this guitar.

I"m going to keep this part of the build simple to not mess anything up!

Thank you all for your contributions on this thread - it got me thinking better than I was and ultimately inspired probably a more reasonable approach for someone at my level.

Thank you all,
Best,
Phil Donovan

[Philip Donovan]

Interesting,
I made a visit to local luthier Jon Mouradian for a current assessment on the progress of this electric baritone I'm building. He verified that there was indeed enough string to edge distance to use the bridge that is mounted and that for a little more distance the frets can be beveled as straight up as desired. That was nice to hear, and he showed me with a string as he described what he was seeing.

What truly surprised me is that he told me he thinks I would be up for the job of fretting the neck myself. I was initially taken aback and commented that I thought a good fret job was on the level of an artisan and not just a good technician. He remarked that this was true in the case of a "re-fret", that that is whole different level of skill but, what I have before me is a neck that is level and straight in all dimensions with new pre-radiused and pre-slotted fingerboard with virgin fret slots. He said if I have been able to take the guitar as far as I have with very good results, then I can take it to the fretting stage with a good modicum of confidence. He said he would support me and let me borrow luthier tools for each phase of the fret job. I told him I need to think about that but very grateful for the offer to support me in doing the fretting work. Not what I expected but, I will think long and hard about it, and make my best call. Although this guitar is to have and old folk art look to it, I do insist that it is a world class performer interms of the playability. I just never thought I would be able to bring the fretting to that level myself. We will see.

thanks again for following and commenting on this journey. It remains full of interest and surprise.

Best,
Phil Donovan

[Barry Daniels]

Don't expect your first fret job to be a "world class performer", but yes, you should dive in and fret that puppy.

[Philip Donovan]

Thank you both.

Perhaps I could ask John it he would inspect my work as I go while giving him the freedom to adjust, fix, any step that is not up to his standards (at least what we would expect of me). I would pay him for that time and work, and meanwhile I would be getting some good experience and feedback while living in the hope of a well performing instrument. I guess I really couldn't ask for more.

I imagine the next step would be to decide on fret type, purchase a set of pre-bent frets, and arbor press them into the slots. That was his suggestion and we'll take it from there. Thanks again for following up on this!

Best,
Phil D

[Bryan Bear]

I agree with above. You won't do a perfect fret job on your first. But. . . you will never do great fretjobs until you start doing them. Sounds like you have a safety net, so you should probably go for it.

This is probably not what you want to hear but I'll say it anyway. Setting out to make your dream guitar or something specific like your baritone will not really turn out like you have in your head when you start. You will learn a lot and your concept of your dream guitar will change as and after you make it. Once it is done, there will be a whole list of little things you wish you had done a little differently. That's okay though. however it turns our you will LOVE it. I'm just saying, there will be other projects in your future. Getting the first one done and playable is super rewarding but it is also just a step towards what you will end up wanting to do. So yeah, fret that thing. . . you will be doing more fret jobs in the future. . .