Tonewood & body thickness

[Fernando Esteves]

Hello!
I'm starting today a course of archtop build.
it will have 24.75" scale, roasted Adirondack top and bracing.

My doubts:
1) I've offers of Mahogany, Bloodwood, Imbuia (Walnut cousin), Brazilian Rosewood, Pink Jequitibá and some other woods.
I want a archtop tone but with a little more attack and punch, not so sweet. I'm going parallel bracing because of it and am in doubt which wood to use on B/S.
Any ideas?

2) Body thickness: I read on Benedetto's book that optimal thickness is 3". Heard some L7C with 3.25" and wanted a little less sweet.
I've the impression that if I do 3" or 2-7/8" I could help that too.
Am I correct?
Cheers

[Alan Carruth]

A shallower body should bring up the 'punch' and treble a bit. So will making the sound holes larger. Remember the fool with the pepper shaker: just because a little bit is good that doesn't mean that a lot will be terrific.

[Darrel Friesen]

Figured maple is more or less the most common back and side wood for traditional archtops.

[Fernando Esteves]

A shallower body should bring up the 'punch' and treble a bit. So will making the sound holes larger. Remember the fool with the pepper shaker: just because a little bit is good that doesn't mean that a lot will be terrific.

Thank you. My idea is 1/8" or 1/16" thinner only. nothing more than that

Figured maple is more or less the most common back and side wood for traditional archtops.

Yes, but it's quite expensive here in Brazil, I'm going for local woods probably

[Alan Carruth]

I don't think makin the box 1/8" shallower will make a lot of difference, but 1/4" might be noticeable. A friend and I once cut 3/4" (~ 18 mm) off the ribs of 'Joe Pass' model guitar, and it was quite a change, iirc.

I made my first arch top out of mahogany. The owner says he sure hopes I remember what I did on that one, because if anything happens to it he'll be back for another like it. I have some notes, but that was more than thirty years ago, and I often can't remember what I had for breakfast yesterday, so... OTOH, it does show that yuou can make a nice arch top out of mahogany.

Our North American black walnut is very close it it's properties to soft maple, and makes a great substitute wood. I've got a couple of pictures of a walnut/maple (and Red spruce/WRC) 'Harlequin' fiddle on the 'Bowed Instrument' page of this site. If Imbuia is not too dense it should work well: I have only encountered it as veneer.

I once made a small round hole arch top with Padauk B&S, and it was pretty harsh. I'd steer clear of similarly dense and low damping woods. There's a sense in which making arched plates is like fooling softer and higher damping woods into acting more like a dense, low damping rosewood, and if you start out with a rosewood-type of material to begin with it can be too much.

[Fernando Esteves]

I don't think makin the box 1/8" shallower will make a lot of difference, but 1/4" might be noticeable. A friend and I once cut 3/4" (~ 18 mm) off the ribs of 'Joe Pass' model guitar, and it was quite a change, iirc.

...

Thanks a lot, Alan. Will have that in mind!

[Barry Daniels]

Sounds like 1/2" might be the sweet spot.

[Fernando Esteves]

Anyone with any experience with Gonçalo Alves (Muiracatiara) as Back and Side? Local and pretty, said to be along Mahogany tone, but seems to be harder in my experience

[Fernando Esteves]

Sounds like 1/2" might be the sweet spot.

Sounds interesting this idea! Ever tried?

[Barry Daniels]

Based my comment on Alan's information.

[Randolph Rhett]

I’ve built several thinner than 3”. There are so many factors it is hard to say what exactly the tonal difference. I can say that a 2” archtop 18” long and 15” at the lower bout is my most comfortable to play. I think the thickness and carve of the top plate is much more influential on tone. A thin top, and especially a thin recurve seems to give a boomier sound. A thick top or little recurve tend to be sharper and more percussive. But, again, there are so many factors all a part time builder like me can do is make broad decisions and let the wood decide the rest.

[Clay Schaeffer]

Imbuia might be a good choice. It should work similar to walnut and has a nice spicy smell. It also looks quite nice. Giannini built some guitars using that wood.

[Fernando Esteves]

Thanks guys!