Iwata LPH80

[Steve Sawyer]

This spray gun was mentioned in another thread recently, and I added it to my Amazon wish list.

The wife is asking what I want for Christmas, and this came to mind. However, I just don't have the space for a large compressor, and the specs on that gun state it can operate on 1.8cfm @ 13PSI. My small compressor does 3.8cfm @ 40psi - a California Air Tools 4610A.

Is anyone else successfully using this gun with a comparable small compressor?

[Christ Kacoyannakis]

I don't have specific experience with this gun, but a couple of years ago, I was considering moving away from my SATA HVLP turbine set up, and did a lot of research on guns. I was looking very hard at smaller SATA and IWATA guns. I spoke to a lot of knowledgeable people in both the spray and luthier community. The conses seemed to be that spraying musical instruments was not like spraying cars, where long strokes and overlayed shots were more common. With a guitar or other musical instrument you are making very small passes and maybe only 3 or 4 passes to do a front or back, and at those rates of spray, even a smaller compressor would be able to keep up.

What I did have experience with was a Makita 3 inch random orbit sander, which was supposed to require a lot more cfm than my liitle Porter Cable was putting out, but in never stopped or slowed down while sanding my guitar.

I think for spraying musical instruments what is more important is that you adequately filter the air out of the hose, so that no moisture comes out of the nozzle and contaminates your finish. Hope this helps you.

[Steve Sawyer]

Thanks, Christ - good info, and a good point about the differences between painting small items typical of lutherie or even much of the stuff that we do in woodworking vs things like vehicles. Having no experience with spraying, I hadn't thought of that. I just installed an air line in my shop and added a filter between the compressor and the line which should address the moisture issue when doing water-borne finishes in the shop, but I should probably pick up a second one for when I do something like nitro or urethane which will be done outdoors or at the least in the garage when the weather permits.

[Christ Kacoyannakis]

I have an inline filter that filters out particles down to half a micron, and then I put a little disposable filter right after the hose and before the tool (random orbital sander mostly, but some nail guns). Not critical for these tools, but it does keep the moisture out of the tools.

[Barry Daniels]

I had to battle drops of moisture in my compressed air system and learned that the normal filters are not designed to remove moisture or water droplets. For that you really need an air dryer. I have a dessicant type of air dryer that uses a couple of pounds of silica get.

[Steve Sawyer]

Barry - can that be placed next to the compressor or should it be nearer the gun?

[Joel Nowland]

I use the Iwata LPH80 for sunbursts and it is an amazing gun. I have not used it with a small compressor but it think it will work with the CFM you have if you are spraying one guitar at a time.

I have tried a lot of brands of guns and the Iwata is the best.

[Steve Sawyer]

I use the Iwata LPH80 for sunbursts and it is an amazing gun.

Yeah - I've seen many positive reviews, and it really seems to be well-suited to guitars because of the ability to get both a very narrow spray suitable to sunbursts as you point out, and a wide fan for solid color and clearcoats.

[Barry Daniels]

The air dryer should be placed near the compressor and this keeps water out of your hose.

Here is the one I bought. https://www.grainger.com/product/WILKER ... chBar=true

[Todd Stock]

SATA has an HVLP gun for turbines? Sure we are not confusing conversion guns (e.g., HP/LV compressed air converted to LP/HV air flow in the gun) with turbine guns (HV/LP provided by turbine external to the gun)?

[Steve Sawyer]

SATA has an HVLP gun for turbines? Sure we are not confusing conversion guns (e.g., HP/LV compressed air converted to LP/HV air flow in the gun) with turbine guns (HV/LP provided by turbine external to the gun)?

I am such a noob on spraying that I have no idea what you're asking, Todd.

Can someone help out with a little translation here? Is Todd asking an important question that I should be asking?

[Peter Wilcox]

The air dryer should be placed near the compressor and this keeps water out of your hose.
Here is the one I bought.

Wow! At $275, that's one advantage of living in an arid high desert climate.

[Steve Sawyer]

Wow! At $275, that's one advantage of living in an arid high desert climate.

Detroit gets pretty humid at times, but it ain't Houston. I might try to get away with the dryer from HF for about $60!

[Christ Kacoyannakis]

Todd, good catch! You are absolutely correct. I was tired when I wrote my first post. It is not SATA, but FUJI. I tried to edit my post, but I can't figure it out. My turbine system is a FUJI turbine.

[Steve Sawyer]

I use the Iwata LPH80 for sunbursts and it is an amazing gun. I have not used it with a small compressor but it think it will work with the CFM you have if you are spraying one guitar at a time.

I have tried a lot of brands of guns and the Iwata is the best.

Joel - I don't seem to see needle options for these. The one I've been looking at ships with a .6mm needle, which I'm guessing might be good for nitro, but something heavier like WB or urethane might need a larger needle no? I don't even see needles listed as parts or accessories on the Iwata website, but I see some vendors shipping with 1.0mm and 1.2mm needles.

What needle sizes are you using, and did you purchase them at the same time as the gun?

[Todd Stock]

If you already had a larger compressor, I think the Iwata would be a decent deal at about $430 for bursts and some instrument work, but although the SATA and Iwata guns claim to sip air, they are all happier with a larger tank and good filter/dryer/regulator system. Sure - you can spray with a pancake or other job site compressor (and I have), but expect some limitations. If you had already planned to invest in a more capable compressor, a larger gun that will handle general finishing tasks like the Iwata LPH-400 or similar (~$500-$600) would make more sense than the mini guns from SATA or Iwata.

For $190 more than the Iwata gun alone, the Fuji MiniMite 3 with T-75G gun provides a portable solution that will handle WB and lacquers and does it without the filter/dryer/regulator stack ($ to $$$, depending on how serious you get). Turbine systems provide warm, dry, filtered air, and extend outdoors spraying to colder and warmer days, and more humid days than conventional or conversion guns, so I can spray at 70% RH/50 deg F days in spring and fall, or 95 deg F days during the summer.

The downside to turbines has been the guns...10 years ago, all turbine guns were cup-style and had limited fan width controls. The last two generations of turbine guns have revolutionized the business, with the current T-70/T-75G guns providing the same gun experience as quality HVLP conversion guns...full material and fan width control, gravity feed, pressurized cup for consistent feed of thicker bodied finishes, and ability to quickly clean and change-over from WB to solvent based finish.

For those with older turbine systems, dump those bleeder or non-pressurized cup guns and upgrade to to a gravity gun like the T-75G with full fan controls, etc. Even the old Turbinaire 3 stage turbines designed for bleeder guns can be used with non-bleeder, current gun guns with a 5 minute mod to the hose connection or air outlet line.

[Steve Sawyer]

So...Todd...

My take-away from your comments is that if I'm starting from scratch with spraying (and have no plans to acquire a larger compressor) the best buy-once-and-cry-once choice is to go with a good turbine system.

Even from a cost standpoint, it ain't all that bad - $300 for just the gun or a bit over $600 for the turbine system (the one you're recommending).

Thanks. I really appreciate your input.

[David King]

Top quality bursts with a turbine gun? I'd be interested in seeing that.

[Todd Stock]

There's no real functional difference between the latest two generations of turbine guns and good conversion guns...I have Iwata and SATA conversion guns and seldom bring them out. That said, even with older bleeder turbines, it's a technique versus tools approach...I generally have to intentionally degrade atomization to get something that looks and smells like a vintage sprayed burst.

One of two guitar-shaped octave mandolins built for an OLF annual competition...we did two instruments, with each under $150 total in materials...this one has an 8 piece top from two different near-perfect red spruce 2x4's...think we had $4.50 total in the two tops. Both instruments sold quickly, despite the budget nature of construction.

[Todd Stock]

The second instrument's burst is modeled on a vintage instrument owned by the buyer's father.

I can see what else I have. These were sprayed with the predecessor to the Fuji T-70/T-75 turbine guns, using a Turbinaire 3-stage turbine. The T-75 is a major improvement over that gun, with the ability to go to dime-sized fan for touch-up work...pretty much what my SATA MJ-3 does, but the T-75 can also lay down an 8" wide wet coat of unthinned McFaddens or Behlens.