balanced tone and the unwound G string

[Brian Evans]

A question for those who put acoustic guitar strings on their acoustic archtops. I've never got on well with wound G strings. To me they are stiff, dead sounding, and create an imbalance in tone between the G string and the unwound B and E strings which I find most annoying in single note playing up the neck. I always like to have an unwound G string, around .020", in a set of .011 - .052 or .012 - .053's. But almost no manufacturer - no one I can buy locally to me anyway - makes such a set in phosphor bronze or 80 - 20 bronze or your typical acoustic guitar set. Now I can't even buy single .020' plain strings locally, neither of the two stores in a 100km radius carries them. So - is it just me who doesn't like the tonal balance of a wound G string? I know for instance that Jim Hall played an .011" - .052" set with a plain .020" G string (or was claimed to have) but that was on an electric instrument so nickle strings. What strings do you use on your acoustic archtops that don't have magnetic pickups to influence your choice?

Thanks, Brian

[Randolph Rhett]

Lately, and to my total surprise, nylon.

[Brian Evans]

Do tell me more! Nylon on an instrument "intended" for steel?

Brian

[Randolph Rhett]

I've discovered that an archtop is different than a flat top when it comes to switching the strings out. Science based luthiers can say more, but on my builds (20" body length, 25" scale length, 7" tailpiece) the nylon seems to have just enough downforce so that I've not noticed any buzzing. There is enough string energy being transferred to produce tone. The tailpiece is sure not going to be ripped off by nylon strings. Yes, I had to prepare a second nut. So as far as working physically, it just did. Couldn't have done that with a typical flat top, I don't think.

As far as tone, I've been surprised. Not a classical by any means, but sweet sounding and full. Not as loud as playing honking flat wounds, but I wouldn't necessarily use them for performances. Practice and recording acoustically they sound surprisingly nice. I play without a pick, so there is that too. However, a blues friend wailed away on the nylon strings and said he actually thought the tone improved when he really bit into the strings.

The evolution was that I had a very thinly carved redwood top (insanely old with very tight growth rings recovered from a 150year old water tower in Norther California). I put some "jazz" flat wound medium strings on it out of habit. It just didn't sound right. It was compressed sounding. A bit of a dud. So I switched out the strings for some Phosphor Bronze mediums. That was better, but somehow not right. Then I put on some nickel 49-11. Wrong. Next I tried some "Silk and Steel". That actually sounded much better. However, now I had a problem that the pickup was useless. On the nylon core strings I had no output and the steel core strings I had tons of volume. I got so frustrated that I actually took the pickup off the guitar (floating Kent Armstrong 12 pole).

Then I broke a string. I went to the little store in town, and they didn't have Martin Silk and Steel strings. I didn't have a pickup, so as a lark I bought some ball end nylon (black treble strings) with ball ends. It's been a long time since I've played nylon strings. I took classical lessons in my teens, but that was back when dinosaurs still roamed the earth. It was a very strange transition, but the sweetness and fullness of the tone was undeniable.

I have since made a number of carbon fiber topped arch tops. I was putting nickel light gauge strings (NYXL 46-10 Balanced Tension). I "decided" to keep #3 (operator error caused an embarrassing cosmetic flaw). I couldn't find any NYXL's. I had bought 3 sets of the ball end nylon string. I put them on and LOVED it.

Now, to be fair, my carbon fiber topped arch tops are VERY different from a spruce top. For one the weigh about a third of the spruce. The energy imparted from the nylon strings is PLENTY to get a clear, loud, and projecting tone. They also tend to have a purer sound with less overtones than spruce. That said, the redwood topped guitar worked well with nylon. I also LOVE the acoustic sound of a good archtop, which to me means a guitar with lots of midrange and punch and great one note clarity even if that sacrifices the sound as a strumming instrument. I experiment in a non-scientific seat of the pants way trying to improve the tone unplugged. That's what lead me to making carbon fiber topped instruments.

I suspect on a heavily built spruce archtop that is intended as an electric guitar with acoustic overtones you might not get much out of the nylon strings. But as I said in my earlier post I was very surprised at how well it worked on the last couple of guitars I've built.

[Randolph Rhett]

FWIW, here is a quick example of the CF guitar with nylon strings. This was done with a cheap webcam and mic, raw, no effects or editing. Not the best recording, but gives you an idea of the sound.

https://youtu.be/0wo3xpoIOoM

[Barry Daniels]

Nice archtop tone, Randolph.

[Randolph Rhett]

Thanks! I keep tweaking the design, but the nylon stings were a pleasant surprise.

[Stephen Neal Saqui]

I don't much like bronze strings on archtops period!! Why don't you try some John Pearse nickel strings...they have a jazz set that is .012-.052. and is balanced. You can buy them direct.

http://www.jpstrings.com/brstring.htm#acousticelectric